My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for me.
My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for me.
Instant response, instant cutoff, configurable run duration, no red/green wiring, easily scalable.
Before starting, I'll say that this design is inspired by a post on the forums by User_Name.
https://forums.factorio.com/forum/viewtop ... f=8&t=6617
Okay so this screenshot has all the important parts visible. Ignore the roboports, pump jacks, and turrets.
http://i.imgur.com/KXp0EIp.jpg
I'll go through it according to the numbers in the picture:
1.) This line is connected to the main power system in the factory. Notice that the wires DO NOT touch the line of small power poles below. I'll get back to that. In my system, there are 4 steam lines with 12 boilers and 15 steam generators each. You can scale as needed.
2.) This is the detection area. There is a requester chest which always has a stack of fuel in it (coal in this case). These arms are powered by the main grid. The upper inserter takes fuel out of the chest, while the lower inserter puts it back in. While the system has power, both arms work constantly and so no fuel gets past the 2nd inserter. In the case of power failure, the arms start to stutter and the fuel already on the conveyor belt moves past the second arm.
3.) A little hard to see, but this is a burner inserter; it has to be, because it needs to be independent of all electrical sources. It is filled with a stack of solid fuel and only runs in case of emergency so it will never run out of fuel. In case of power failure, fuel from the conveyor moves within its range and gets put into the boiler behind it, powering the single steam engine.
4.) This power line is powered ONLY by the single steam engine on the left, not by the main electrical system of the plant. This means that it is only powered when the system has detected a power outage. The ONLY things powered by this line are the pumps below each water tank. During regular operation, the pumps are not powered and therefore no water flows through them, and so the steam system is not operational. When these are powered, hot water is delivered to the steam engines and they turn on. (Small note in case it's not obvious: all the small pumps are facing left)
Important note on setting it up: Because the wiring has to be a specific way, you may have to wire part of it up manually. You can do this by shift-clicking a power pole, which removes all its connections. You can then craft copper cable and manually wire each pole to where it's supposed to go.
Changing output/adding capacity: You can easily adjust the number of burners or steam generators in each line, or add whole new lines to suit your power needs. Add pumps as needed to get enough water flow.
Holding tanks: The tanks hold a large amount of hot water, ready to go. Because your steam system is (in theory, at least) running only for small periods, you can get away with installing fewer boilers than you'd normally need. Even in the worst case scenario, you should have all day to fill your tanks up with hot water while the solar panels supply electricity. The tanks should last more than one full night.
Run time: So basically, this system will run for a certain amount of time and then turn itself off. If main power is still not restored, it'll turn on again and keep cycling until your power issues have been resolved. The amount of time that it runs can be adjusted at area (2) in the picture. You can adjust the type of fuel you're using (wood, coal, or solid fuel); a longer burning fuel will run the system longer. You can also increase the length of the belt between the two arms. A longer belt would have more fuel on it when power fails, and therefore let the emergency system run longer. You can also change these two arms to fast inserters to have the same effect as increasing belt length. Generally, you would want this system to run for a long time because you will need to ensure your factory is running smoothly until the issue is resolved, while hopefully recharging your accumulators enough to deal with potential laser turret usage.
With my exact setup, it provides 30 MW power and runs long enough to last the night when solar panels aren't online. It will run at full 30 MW power for at least two nights before the storage tanks run out, and at then it runs at 17 MW continuously.
Before starting, I'll say that this design is inspired by a post on the forums by User_Name.
https://forums.factorio.com/forum/viewtop ... f=8&t=6617
Okay so this screenshot has all the important parts visible. Ignore the roboports, pump jacks, and turrets.
http://i.imgur.com/KXp0EIp.jpg
I'll go through it according to the numbers in the picture:
1.) This line is connected to the main power system in the factory. Notice that the wires DO NOT touch the line of small power poles below. I'll get back to that. In my system, there are 4 steam lines with 12 boilers and 15 steam generators each. You can scale as needed.
2.) This is the detection area. There is a requester chest which always has a stack of fuel in it (coal in this case). These arms are powered by the main grid. The upper inserter takes fuel out of the chest, while the lower inserter puts it back in. While the system has power, both arms work constantly and so no fuel gets past the 2nd inserter. In the case of power failure, the arms start to stutter and the fuel already on the conveyor belt moves past the second arm.
3.) A little hard to see, but this is a burner inserter; it has to be, because it needs to be independent of all electrical sources. It is filled with a stack of solid fuel and only runs in case of emergency so it will never run out of fuel. In case of power failure, fuel from the conveyor moves within its range and gets put into the boiler behind it, powering the single steam engine.
4.) This power line is powered ONLY by the single steam engine on the left, not by the main electrical system of the plant. This means that it is only powered when the system has detected a power outage. The ONLY things powered by this line are the pumps below each water tank. During regular operation, the pumps are not powered and therefore no water flows through them, and so the steam system is not operational. When these are powered, hot water is delivered to the steam engines and they turn on. (Small note in case it's not obvious: all the small pumps are facing left)
Important note on setting it up: Because the wiring has to be a specific way, you may have to wire part of it up manually. You can do this by shift-clicking a power pole, which removes all its connections. You can then craft copper cable and manually wire each pole to where it's supposed to go.
Changing output/adding capacity: You can easily adjust the number of burners or steam generators in each line, or add whole new lines to suit your power needs. Add pumps as needed to get enough water flow.
Holding tanks: The tanks hold a large amount of hot water, ready to go. Because your steam system is (in theory, at least) running only for small periods, you can get away with installing fewer boilers than you'd normally need. Even in the worst case scenario, you should have all day to fill your tanks up with hot water while the solar panels supply electricity. The tanks should last more than one full night.
Run time: So basically, this system will run for a certain amount of time and then turn itself off. If main power is still not restored, it'll turn on again and keep cycling until your power issues have been resolved. The amount of time that it runs can be adjusted at area (2) in the picture. You can adjust the type of fuel you're using (wood, coal, or solid fuel); a longer burning fuel will run the system longer. You can also increase the length of the belt between the two arms. A longer belt would have more fuel on it when power fails, and therefore let the emergency system run longer. You can also change these two arms to fast inserters to have the same effect as increasing belt length. Generally, you would want this system to run for a long time because you will need to ensure your factory is running smoothly until the issue is resolved, while hopefully recharging your accumulators enough to deal with potential laser turret usage.
With my exact setup, it provides 30 MW power and runs long enough to last the night when solar panels aren't online. It will run at full 30 MW power for at least two nights before the storage tanks run out, and at then it runs at 17 MW continuously.
Last edited by Saadli on Mon Dec 08, 2014 4:27 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
wow. that is rather ingenious. How long have you been using this setup?
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
Very nice setup! I will try this out in my next game
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
I set it up yesterday and today. It didn't take too long, it's a relatively simple concept.PharAway wrote:wow. that is rather ingenious. How long have you been using this setup?
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Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
Nice concept i think i have to copy that
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
Ruger wrote:Very nice setup! I will try this out in my next game
Eurofighter1200 wrote:Nice concept i think i have to copy that
Thanks . Let me know if you have any improvements or suggestions, I'm sure there are ways to make this better.
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Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
Its miles away from your setup but its in my base and there is not so much space also its my old first Steamenginepark from this game so now i can use it with your technique. It provides less than 15 MW of energy is not enough for my actual energy demand but i need it only for some nights and when the biters heavilly attacking me and the lasers need too much Energy its not tested yet because i had no blackout the last days.
Maybee i build a new one on a new location much bigger and even better because its really fun
Maybee i build a new one on a new location much bigger and even better because its really fun
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
I'm liking this idea, currently got too much load in the daytime to run without steam, but could prove useful later
Eurofighter, shouldn't the inserter feeding the single boiler be a burner?
you could run out of power completely before the inserter puts the fuel in and then your proper stuck!
Eurofighter, shouldn't the inserter feeding the single boiler be a burner?
you could run out of power completely before the inserter puts the fuel in and then your proper stuck!
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Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
Oh yes i have seen this when i made the pictures build the burner inserter and then used the old picture
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
Nice setup.
btw you only need 3 pumps per 15 engine line if your pipes are short
Underground pipe is counted as a single pipe no matter the real length
btw you only need 3 pumps per 15 engine line if your pipes are short
Underground pipe is counted as a single pipe no matter the real length
Attach your blueprints to forum posts with Foreman or Blueprint string.
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
I did some testing and you're totally right, only 3 pumps are required. This is good because it lets the system run longer per cycle and so it's easier to set it up exactly how you want.
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
Thank you for this, Saadli. Your picture and instructions were very clear. I set mine up with no difficulty, and it's worked flawlessly ever since!
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Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
the one think i may add is a Wooden chest betreen the belt and Boiler
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
I'm glad it's working well for youTinyboss wrote:Thank you for this, Saadli. Your picture and instructions were very clear. I set mine up with no difficulty, and it's worked flawlessly ever since!
Hmm I'm not sure what the purpose of that would be?Lee_newsum wrote:the one think i may add is a Wooden chest betreen the belt and Boiler
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for
I think it's worth a reminder that if you came here looking for a way to turn steam power on/off, you don't need storage tanks.
Hot water storage is used by the OP to reduce the number of boilers required. I suppose this is an interesting exercise, but having spent a few hours playing with hot water, it can be incredibly frustrating, and once you lose temperature, nearly impossible to recover. Storage tanks are quite a bit more expensive than boilers, and while you may save a little fuel (until things cool down), the whole point is to turn it off anyway.
The electric pumps are a brilliant solution. When they're off, no cold water flows into the boilers, and the steam engines aren't doing anything so their water remains at 100 degrees, ready to go. For a standard 1/14/10 offshore/boiler/steam arrangement, you need two electric pumps (30 vs. 60 for offshore). Also, you don't need to manually re-wire the poles as long as you leave yourself enough space, something like this:
Hot water storage is used by the OP to reduce the number of boilers required. I suppose this is an interesting exercise, but having spent a few hours playing with hot water, it can be incredibly frustrating, and once you lose temperature, nearly impossible to recover. Storage tanks are quite a bit more expensive than boilers, and while you may save a little fuel (until things cool down), the whole point is to turn it off anyway.
The electric pumps are a brilliant solution. When they're off, no cold water flows into the boilers, and the steam engines aren't doing anything so their water remains at 100 degrees, ready to go. For a standard 1/14/10 offshore/boiler/steam arrangement, you need two electric pumps (30 vs. 60 for offshore). Also, you don't need to manually re-wire the poles as long as you leave yourself enough space, something like this:
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for me.
Hi guys, I haven't been playing factorio for the past few months. Have people found any further way to refine this?
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for me.
In 1-2 months there will be 0.12 anyways and that will allow better adjustments due to new circuit logic possibilities.Saadli wrote:Hi guys, I haven't been playing factorio for the past few months. Have people found any further way to refine this?
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for me.
I'd like to think I have sufficiently refined the concept.Saadli wrote:Hi guys, I haven't been playing factorio for the past few months. Have people found any further way to refine this?
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for me.
I think this is wrong picture. I mostly see a lake, no numbers...Saadli wrote:Okay so this screenshot has all the important parts visible. Ignore the roboports, pump jacks, and turrets.
http://i.imgur.com/KXp0EIp.jpg
I'll go through it according to the numbers in the picture:
Re: My take on using steam as a backup. Works perfectly for me.
Try to right-click the image, open in new tab/window. The forum cuts images off a lot of the time. It's usually easy to tell, because the hotbar at the bottom of the screenshot isn't centered.bartekltg wrote:I think this is wrong picture. I mostly see a lake, no numbers...Saadli wrote:Okay so this screenshot has all the important parts visible. Ignore the roboports, pump jacks, and turrets.
http://i.imgur.com/KXp0EIp.jpg
I'll go through it according to the numbers in the picture: