Factorio Forums

About the two different recipes for Tungsten carbide plate, I've noticed something that strikes me as an inconsistency at first glance.
One takes 7 seconds for 1x carbon and 1x Tungsten oxide, the other takes 14 seconds for 1x carbon and 1x Powdered tungsten. Thing is, Powdered tungsten is processed Tungsten oxide and therefor 'further down the line', yet it takes longer to produce the plate with it. Am I missing something?

Bob, I have a late-game / finished high throughput factory including all your mods.

I have noticed a consistent (at all phases of game and sizes of factory) shortage of chlorine that cannot be automated away through additional salt-water electroloysis because of the enormous excess of sodium hydroxide which has very limited sinks (Aluminium production... unlikely to need more than a few thousand all game). I have literally taken to automating the filling of 30+ iron chests of the stuff then manually shotgunning them every 10 minutes or so. This is far, far, far from an ideal workaround in a game focused on automation.

Please please please either ~x4 the chlorine output of that reaction, x0.25 the sodium hydroxide or create a new, very large use for sodium hydoxide, or ideally some combination. As a suggestion for a new use, in real life sodium hydroxide is used to scrub air pollution from the air, e.g.

2 NaOH + CO2 → Na2CO3 + H2O

or

SO2 + NaOH = Na2SO4 + H2O

Ingame this could be Sodium Hydroxide [and air?] in a chemical furnace, 10 seconds -> Water [+ Slurry?] and -Pollution.

Another option would be to give us a way to "vent" excess solids automatically, e.g. as a furnace recipe.

Lallante wrote:Bob, I have a late-game / finished high throughput factory including all your mods.

I have noticed a consistent (at all phases of game and sizes of factory) shortage of chlorine that cannot be automated away through additional salt-water electroloysis because of the enormous excess of sodium hydroxide which has very limited sinks (Aluminium production... unlikely to need more than a few thousand all game). I have literally taken to automating the filling of 30+ iron chests of the stuff then manually shotgunning them every 10 minutes or so. This is far, far, far from an ideal workaround in a game focused on automation.

Please please please either ~x4 the chlorine output of that reaction, x0.25 the sodium hydroxide or create a new, very large use for sodium hydoxide, or ideally some combination. As a suggestion for a new use, in real life sodium hydroxide is used to scrub air pollution from the air, e.g.

In the meantime, I recommend the compression chest mod, that what I use to store my excess. I've got a little over 750k in it so far.

viewtopic.php?f=91&t=4845

SuicidalKid wrote: In the meantime, I recommend the compression chest mod, that what I use to store my excess. I've got a little over 750k in it so far.

viewtopic.php?f=91&t=4845

I find the compression chest idea rather cheaty for my taste. Void chest, fluid void and the gas vent pump give a way to remove solids, liquids and gasses respectively to allow a line to operate but without invoking 'magic' like bags of holding.

This mod provides a way to deal with the masses of sodium hydroxide by automating its removal (recipe that takes multiple hydroxides and spits out just a single one, effectively destroying some): viewtopic.php?f=91&t=19970

That mod also has a lot, LOT more than just that one feature, of course; I find it is a very nice addition to go on top of bob's mods.

MainTango wrote:About the two different recipes for Tungsten carbide plate, I've noticed something that strikes me as an inconsistency at first glance.
One takes 7 seconds for 1x carbon and 1x Tungsten oxide, the other takes 14 seconds for 1x carbon and 1x Powdered tungsten. Thing is, Powdered tungsten is processed Tungsten oxide and therefor 'further down the line', yet it takes longer to produce the plate with it. Am I missing something?

Yes. Realism.

The most efficient way to make Tungsten Carbide is Carbon + Tungsten oxide powder.
The alternate method of Carbon and pure tungsten powder requires more energy, because you're forcing a chemical reaction, rather and doing atomic substitution.

The less efficient method was added purely because by the time you get around to making tungsten carbide, you're likely to already be have a large supply of pure tungsten powder ready to be smelted into bars. This will become a bit more of an important point if and when I force tungsten products in machines. Realistically, tungsten carbide is a ceramic, and should be produced in it's final shape, not turned into a bar (plate) to be crafted with later. Tungsten is an awkward material to work with, as in reality, the melting point is so high that pretty much everything made from it is made in it's final shape.



Sodium Hydroxide is a common problem, I've already halved the amount of it that you get from the chemical reaction. Though considering it is a solid, and the others are a gas, I could reduce it even further. (in fact I want to re-visit and re-ballance the entire electrolsis system for the next major release). In the mean time I recomend a mod named void chest. (Deletes anything placed in the chest) You could use something like a smart inserter on your logistics network set to move sodium hydroxide into a void chest when there is more than 10k on the network. (A standard chest holds 4.8k, so that's a little over 2 boxes full)

To note, I have considered more options for sodium hydroxide, I just havn't programmed any yet.

A quick mod I made which someone requested and I needed in my current save.
Additional Refineries

bobingabout wrote: Sodium Hydroxide is a common problem, I've already halved the amount of it that you get from the chemical reaction. Though considering it is a solid, and the others are a gas, I could reduce it even further. (in fact I want to re-visit and re-ballance the entire electrolsis system for the next major release). In the mean time I recomend a mod named void chest. (Deletes anything placed in the chest) You could use something like a smart inserter on your logistics network set to move sodium hydroxide into a void chest when there is more than 10k on the network. (A standard chest holds 4.8k, so that's a little over 2 boxes full)

To note, I have considered more options for sodium hydroxide, I just havn't programmed any yet.

Void chest, fluid void and gas vent pump are all necessities for me when I make a Bobs game. Logic belts lets you know when a product is backing up on a belt so I use those to switch on smart inserters tossing the extra into void chests. Processes stopping because sulfur dioxide or sulfuric acid has filled up? Fluid void and a wire will fix that. Hydrogen I turn into fuel cubes but other gasses just vent off over 2300.

you shouldn't really need anything extra for my mod to be able to handed the gasses... Hydrogen, Chrlorine, Oxygen and Nitrogen all have the option to be vented with a pump in my mod. Oil based products can be cracked down into hydrogen, and vented. The other chemicals like Nitric acid, And along that chain are basically purpose made, so if you ever have too much, just let the production stall, it's not going to stall any of the other systems, because it's never a byproduct, same with ferric chrloride. So that really just leaves issues with sulfuric acid (A byproduct of one of the metal electrolysis lines) and Sulfur Dioxide (which is another metal electrolysis byproduct, but can be turned into sulfur or sulfuric acid), which can be barreled and then put in the void chest that I recomended.

To be honest, personally, when I start the lead and nickel processing that gives the sulfuric acid byproduct, I stop making it with the oil chain, or use a logic system so it only turns on when the storage is low.

bobingabout wrote:you shouldn't really need anything extra for my mod to be able to handed the gasses... Hydrogen, Chrlorine, Oxygen and Nitrogen all have the option to be vented with a pump in my mod. Oil based products can be cracked down into hydrogen, and vented. The other chemicals like Nitric acid, And along that chain are basically purpose made, so if you ever have too much, just let the production stall, it's not going to stall any of the other systems, because it's never a byproduct, same with ferric chrloride. So that really just leaves issues with sulfuric acid (A byproduct of one of the metal electrolysis lines) and Sulfur Dioxide (which is another metal electrolysis byproduct, but can be turned into sulfur or sulfuric acid), which can be barreled and then put in the void chest that I recomended.

To be honest, personally, when I start the lead and nickel processing that gives the sulfuric acid byproduct, I stop making it with the oil chain, or use a logic system so it only turns on when the storage is low.

The blue gas vent? I thought that was from something else, nvm. Sulfuric acid was the biggest problem buildup and sodium hydroxide kept stalling one of the metal lines. I was using steam engines to bleed off the acid for a while but the fluid void with a small pump does it better and I detest barrels for some reason. Void chests and a logic belt take care of excess solids.

Ratzap wrote:The blue gas vent? I thought that was from something else, nvm.

blue/purple/black spiral, like a black hole behind the image of a basegame small pump icon. That's part of my mod, yes.

Hello bobingabout,

now i'm also at the point to assembly wood from raw wood and can only select wood from heavy oil.
Is it possible to comment out the parts of code which provide the heavy oil wood because i will not use this receipe (plently of treefarms).

Could you give me a hint where i should look for the code, please?

Greetings
steinio

Ratzap wrote:

bobingabout wrote: The blue gas vent? I thought that was from something else, nvm. Sulfuric acid was the biggest problem buildup and sodium hydroxide kept stalling one of the metal lines. I was using steam engines to bleed off the acid for a while but the fluid void with a small pump does it better and I detest barrels for some reason. Void chests and a logic belt take care of excess solids.

Kept running into the same problem with sulfuric acid due to the way how I'm producing all of my lead plates which is Advanced lead processing with Silver ore. Of course I could at least partially switch my lead production to the conventional way of just dumping the Galena into furnaces, so, I guess it's kinda my own fault that I'm drowning in sulfuric acid.

steinio wrote:Hello bobingabout,

now i'm also at the point to assembly wood from raw wood and can only select wood from heavy oil.
Is it possible to comment out the parts of code which provide the heavy oil wood because i will not use this receipe (plently of treefarms).

Could you give me a hint where i should look for the code, please?

Greetings
steinio

I'd really need to look it up. Though it isn't coded to stop allowing you to be able to craft wood from raw wood, it should still be there in the base game's intermediates tab.

Or are you specifically talking about the "I'll use the first recipe I find" bug that stops it from AUTOMATICALLY crafting wood when you try to craft something that uses wood when hand crafting?

Oh sorry, i'm just stupid.

I found the code and deleted the receipes for syntetic wood and resin from oil but it wasn't necessary
because 5dim just moved the wood to it's own plates group and i found only syntetic wood in your group...

Could be marked as solved.

Greetings steinio

bobingabout wrote:

steinio wrote:Hello bobingabout,

now i'm also at the point to assembly wood from raw wood and can only select wood from heavy oil.
Is it possible to comment out the parts of code which provide the heavy oil wood because i will not use this receipe (plently of treefarms).

Could you give me a hint where i should look for the code, please?

Greetings
steinio

I'd really need to look it up. Though it isn't coded to stop allowing you to be able to craft wood from raw wood, it should still be there in the base game's intermediates tab.

Or are you specifically talking about the "I'll use the first recipe I find" bug that stops it from AUTOMATICALLY crafting wood when you try to craft something that uses wood when hand crafting?

This bug, which is annoying. I ran into it today as well, having to remember to carry around synthetic wood or manually convert lumber to basic boards by hand crafting.

Are you sure?
Please look carefully in all categories if there is no wood board from wood.
I also thought it's a bug until I discovered the wood board in an other category then synthetic wood board.

I can't confirm this bug.

Greetings steinio

Running bobplates without bobores shows an error: Error in assignID, recipe with name 'sort-ore-gem' does not exist.
I guess the dependency is not optional "? bobores >= 0.12.0"

Kamel wrote:Running bobplates without bobores shows an error: Error in assignID, recipe with name 'sort-ore-gem' does not exist.
I guess the dependency is not optional "? bobores >= 0.12.0"

Thank you for the report, but this one was actually reported to me last week.
I've fixed it, but I'm in the middle of doing a few other tweaks to the mod before I release an update.

The recipe in question was originally in bobplates, I moved it to bobores, for... reasons... I guess I forgot to move it completely.

Yays... First update of the new year!

Plates 0.12.11:
* Polishing wheel synthetic wood recipe set to 2 seconds.
* Electrolysis reballance (water electrolysis and salt water electrolysis recipe)
* Fixed power consumption of Electrolyser MK1 to 180kW from 144kW, bringing it to 225kJ per time 1 recipe. (MK2 is 200, MK3 180, MK4 160)
* Added Sulfur Dioxide venting
* Changed Nickel processing recipe to give Sulfur Dioxide instead of Sulfuric Acid (same as lead oxide)
* Added barrelled water and lithia water, with fill and empty recipe (Ready to remove the from ground recipe in favor of mining splotches)
* Fixed broken migration script including electronics stuff that has been removed from the mod.
* Removed productivity limitation addition of sort gem ore recipe, the recipe isn't in this mod.
* Solid Fuel from hydrogen now requires a peice of coal too. (to eliminate the perpetual motion machine. Think of it as using hydrogen to upgrade coal to fuel blocks.)
* Adjusted Alien acid fluid colour slightly.


Please note: the change to the Nickel recipe will break your factory layout.