pY Raw Ores Discussion

[pyanodon]

New version ready..please, download the newest version. Check changelog for info

[Ronin]

New version ready..please, download the newest version. Check changelog for info

Deadlock has been removed! Thank you for the quick turnaround!

If you get to feeling bored, I have one more request. It is a new building type for a Barreling Facility. When I was playing the mods with Bob's, he had a 2x2 pump that would fill the barrels. It still required the inserters and chests for the empty and filled barrels. What I would like to see is an "all in one" solution that could be dropped onto any liquid or gas aperture. It would be a combination of the pump, requester chest, and active/passive provider chest based on empty/fill respective with configurable inventory limits. Once you select the function of either fill or empty a barrel type, it would request and send the appropriate items through the logistics system. Part of the headache could also be removed by eliminating the need for empty barrels which would change the function to requester or provider with the barreling facilities creating or consuming the empties at will which would ease the burden on an already overtaxed logistics system.

Once again, thank you for the quick turn around and support. Loving the old and new pY mods.

[immortal_sniper1]

New version ready..please, download the newest version. Check changelog for info

what changelog?

[kingarthur]

New version ready..please, download the newest version. Check changelog for info

what changelog?

First page

[politehnik]

hi and thank you for great mods!
There are some things I found strange.
*Warning* here goes wall of text (sorry for my bad English)
1) How does metal grades work? Some metals become better with grades, some not. Here's amount of plates I can get from metals of different grades, assuming that I have all the technologies but refuse to use metals of higher grades:
Lead:___raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 2 pl.| Grade2- 1 pl.| Grade3- 1 pl.
Iron:____raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 3 pl.| Grade2- 3 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.
Copper:_raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 0 pl.| Grade2- 2 pl.| Grade3- 0.25 pl.| Grade4- 8.33 pl.
Nickel:__raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 0.4 pl.| Grade2- 0 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.| Grade4- 15pl.*

2) Some metal processing researches does not give any reasonable profit. Here's amount of plates per ore for lead, that you can get using all the technologies of "lead processing..." research: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.4 pl/ore; lp02- 0.5 pl/ore; lp03- 0.55 pl/ore; lp04-0.575 pl/ore. (if I miscalculated something, I'm sorry )
Going all the way from "lg03" to "lg04" technologies results only in 0.025 lead plates per ore (only 1 plate profit from 40 ore pieces).
Something similar happens with nickel (unfortunately I didn't test all other metals yet).
It's somehow realistic, but is not optimal in game point of view. There is no point in making all this beautiful machines and technological schemes as of right now. I think it would be better to buff mid and high grade technologies (at least for lead and nickel). Maybe change it to make more profit with better grades? (lead for example: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.2 pl/ore; lp02- 0.3 pl/ore; lp03- 0.45 pl/ore; lp04-0.65 pl/ore)

3) Looks like this charts are outdated: viewtopic.php?f=219&t=61835

PS all calculations were carried out using only full PyMods pack and FNEI.

[immortal_sniper1]

hi and thank you for great mods!
There are some things I found strange.
*Warning* here goes wall of text (sorry for my bad English)
1) How does metal grades work? Some metals become better with grades, some not. Here's amount of plates I can get from metals of different grades, assuming that I have all the technologies but refuse to use metals of higher grades:
Lead:___raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 2 pl.| Grade2- 1 pl.| Grade3- 1 pl.
Iron:____raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 3 pl.| Grade2- 3 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.
Copper:_raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 0 pl.| Grade2- 2 pl.| Grade3- 0.25 pl.| Grade4- 8.33 pl.
Nickel:__raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 0.4 pl.| Grade2- 0 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.| Grade4- 15pl.*

2) Some metal processing researches does not give any reasonable profit. Here's amount of plates per ore for lead, that you can get using all the technologies of "lead processing..." research: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.4 pl/ore; lp02- 0.5 pl/ore; lp03- 0.55 pl/ore; lp04-0.575 pl/ore. (if I miscalculated something, I'm sorry )
Going all the way from "lg03" to "lg04" technologies results only in 0.025 lead plates per ore (only 1 plate profit from 40 ore pieces).
Something similar happens with nickel (unfortunately I didn't test all other metals yet).
It's somehow realistic, but is not optimal in game point of view. There is no point in making all this beautiful machines and technological schemes as of right now. I think it would be better to buff mid and high grade technologies (at least for lead and nickel). Maybe change it to make more profit with better grades? (lead for example: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.2 pl/ore; lp02- 0.3 pl/ore; lp03- 0.45 pl/ore; lp04-0.65 pl/ore)

3) Looks like this charts are outdated: viewtopic.php?f=219&t=61835

PS all calculations were carried out using only full PyMods pack and FNEI.

first lead chain and chrome are exceptions since at high tier you get 2 metals so at low mied you get just one

make math based on 100 input pls or 120 ( 3 blue belts since decimals are hard to follow)
i have been helping py balance chains but process is slow and we didnt do those chais yet
also for some products both direct smelting and melting is available and not sometimes one is better the the other
and yes i also did similar math and found some problems

[Schattenlord]

Hello Pyanodon, I tried to improve my power production with solar panels and discovered that I can't produce Pyrite. The technology chain said it was unlocked with Raw Coal 01 but I can't find it in the crafting menu. Did I miss something?

[immortal_sniper1]

Hello Pyanodon, I tried to improve my power production with solar panels and discovered that I can't produce Pyrite. The technology chain said it was unlocked with Raw Coal 01 but I can't find it in the crafting menu. Did I miss something?

yes you can its made from sulfur and iron /iron oxide one of those 2 and another 2 ways
some recipes are only available on crafting machines

[Schattenlord]

Hello Pyanodon, I tried to improve my power production with solar panels and discovered that I can't produce Pyrite. The technology chain said it was unlocked with Raw Coal 01 but I can't find it in the crafting menu. Did I miss something?

yes you can its made from sulfur and iron /iron oxide one of those 2 and another 2 ways
some recipes are only available on crafting machines

thank you very much for the quick reply. I was aware of this way but I can't find out in which maschine I can produce it. Usually it is displayed in the crafting menu with a symbol of the required building/s. (for example all the oil processing stuff is there as well and it says that you need a chemical plant or oil refinery) but I can't find the one for Pyrite.

It also looks like that I have the same problem with the Centrifugal Pan. I have unlocked the technology (now mining maschines 02 after the update) but it isn't in the crafting menu. Any suggestion what it can be?

[immortal_sniper1]

Hello Pyanodon, I tried to improve my power production with solar panels and discovered that I can't produce Pyrite. The technology chain said it was unlocked with Raw Coal 01 but I can't find it in the crafting menu. Did I miss something?

yes you can its made from sulfur and iron /iron oxide one of those 2 and another 2 ways
some recipes are only available on crafting machines

thank you very much for the quick reply. I was aware of this way but I can't find out in which maschine I can produce it. Usually it is displayed in the crafting menu with a symbol of the required building/s. (for example all the oil processing stuff is there as well and it says that you need a chemical plant or oil refinery) but I can't find the one for Pyrite.

It also looks like that I have the same problem with the Centrifugal Pan. I have unlocked the technology (now mining maschines 02 after the update) but it isn't in the crafting menu. Any suggestion what it can be?

building for the 2 that produce mainly pyrite is high presure furnace ( tech coal1 ; mining maschines 3)
regarding the pan dont you need some coal tech ?
use FNEI mod to see what is made where and from what

[Schattenlord]

Hello Pyanodon, I tried to improve my power production with solar panels and discovered that I can't produce Pyrite. The technology chain said it was unlocked with Raw Coal 01 but I can't find it in the crafting menu. Did I miss something?

yes you can its made from sulfur and iron /iron oxide one of those 2 and another 2 ways
some recipes are only available on crafting machines

thank you very much for the quick reply. I was aware of this way but I can't find out in which maschine I can produce it. Usually it is displayed in the crafting menu with a symbol of the required building/s. (for example all the oil processing stuff is there as well and it says that you need a chemical plant or oil refinery) but I can't find the one for Pyrite.

It also looks like that I have the same problem with the Centrifugal Pan. I have unlocked the technology (now mining maschines 02 after the update) but it isn't in the crafting menu. Any suggestion what it can be?

building for the 2 that produce mainly pyrite is high presure furnace ( tech coal1 ; mining maschines 3)
regarding the pan dont you need some coal tech ?
use FNEI mod to see what is made where and from what

I am using Recipe Explorer Mod to see the what is produced where.

I checked my tech tree and Coal1 and mining maschines 3 are done. The basic Pyrite (3 iron oxid + 3 sulfur) doesn't show up in the high pressure furnace but the one for phosphoros pentasulfide where Pyrite is a by product is available. I also noticed that my game crashes when I use the Recipe Explorer to find the recipe for Pyrite.

Error Code:
Error while running event RecExplo::on_gui_elem_changed (ID 67)
Gui element with name ingredient_table_thickened-coal-fines already present in the parent element.
stack traceback:
__RecExplo__/lua/explo_gui.lua:556: in function 'draw_ingredient'
__RecExplo__/lua/explo_gui.lua:528: in function 'draw_recipe'
__RecExplo__/lua/explo_gui.lua:396: in function 'create_all_recipes'
__RecExplo__/lua/explo_gui.lua:369: in function 'create_all_recipes_container'
__RecExplo__/lua/explo_gui.lua:347: in function 'create_results'
__RecExplo__/lua/explo_gui.lua:342: in function 'update_results'
__RecExplo__/lua/explo_gui.lua:69: in function 'update'
__RecExplo__/lua/events.lua:237: in function <__RecExplo__/lua/events.lua:226>

This looks for me like an ID conflict but I don't know enough about modding. The reason for this error could also be responsible for the invisibilty of the basic Pyrite recipe.

In relation to the Centrifugal Pan, I checked the tech chain (it is unlocked with mining machines 02 - which is done) and the Recipe Explorer says I can craft it by hand or in any assembling maschine but it doesn't exist. (searched the crafting menu and assembly maschine crafting options)

Has someone else the same problem?

[aklesey1]

My suggestion about salt production
Salt evaporation from 200 common water with 50% chance

PY salt_cmn_water.png (170.95 KiB) Viewed 4717 times

Of course may be to keep balance in PY mods that chance can be like 25% not 50%
But its more or less stable method to get salt
Just i'll say again - its too hard to get niobium plates - 1 niobium plates requires 10 salt
Super steel and stainless steel requires niobium plates
Niobium plates and its niobium pipes are also used in many hi-tech buildings
Fuel rods MK01 requires niobium plates
And fuel rods MK01 are used in specific range of recipes like super alloy, for glass production, for silver plates, for NdFeB alloy, for control units which are used for many Super-Mines
And of course fuel rod MK01 is excellent fuel for boilers, for furnaces which requires fuel to work

[pyanodon]

My suggestion about salt production
Salt evaporation from 200 common water with 50% chance
PY salt_cmn_water.png
Of course may be to keep balance in PY mods that chance can be like 25% not 50%
But its more or less stable method to get salt
Just i'll say again - its too hard to get niobium plates - 1 niobium plates requires 10 salt
Super steel and stainless steel requires niobium plates
Niobium plates and its niobium pipes are also used in many hi-tech buildings
Fuel rods MK01 requires niobium plates
And fuel rods MK01 are used in specific range of recipes like super alloy, for glass production, for silver plates, for NdFeB alloy, for control units which are used for many Super-Mines
And of course fuel rod MK01 is excellent fuel for boilers, for furnaces which requires fuel to work

good! i will think about it

[aklesey1]

My suggestion about salt production
Salt evaporation from 200 common water with 50% chance
PY salt_cmn_water.png
Of course may be to keep balance in PY mods that chance can be like 25% not 50%
But its more or less stable method to get salt
Just i'll say again - its too hard to get niobium plates - 1 niobium plates requires 10 salt
Super steel and stainless steel requires niobium plates
Niobium plates and its niobium pipes are also used in many hi-tech buildings
Fuel rods MK01 requires niobium plates
And fuel rods MK01 are used in specific range of recipes like super alloy, for glass production, for silver plates, for NdFeB alloy, for control units which are used for many Super-Mines
And of course fuel rod MK01 is excellent fuel for boilers, for furnaces which requires fuel to work

good! i will think about it

Thank u for agreeing with me
In bob's mods we could get 1 salt from 25 common water with 100% chance - here's variation of salt getting for py mods

[immortal_sniper1]

My suggestion about salt production
Salt evaporation from 200 common water with 50% chance
PY salt_cmn_water.png
Of course may be to keep balance in PY mods that chance can be like 25% not 50%
But its more or less stable method to get salt
Just i'll say again - its too hard to get niobium plates - 1 niobium plates requires 10 salt
Super steel and stainless steel requires niobium plates
Niobium plates and its niobium pipes are also used in many hi-tech buildings
Fuel rods MK01 requires niobium plates
And fuel rods MK01 are used in specific range of recipes like super alloy, for glass production, for silver plates, for NdFeB alloy, for control units which are used for many Super-Mines
And of course fuel rod MK01 is excellent fuel for boilers, for furnaces which requires fuel to work

why not mine the salt in the first place?
the saline water build is a continuous pasive production process

[politehnik]

hi and thank you for great mods!
There are some things I found strange.
*Warning* here goes wall of text (sorry for my bad English)
1) How does metal grades work? Some metals become better with grades, some not. Here's amount of plates I can get from metals of different grades, assuming that I have all the technologies but refuse to use metals of higher grades:
Lead:___raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 2 pl.| Grade2- 1 pl.| Grade3- 1 pl.
Iron:____raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 3 pl.| Grade2- 3 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.
Copper:_raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 0 pl.| Grade2- 2 pl.| Grade3- 0.25 pl.| Grade4- 8.33 pl.
Nickel:__raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 0.4 pl.| Grade2- 0 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.| Grade4- 15pl.*

2) Some metal processing researches does not give any reasonable profit. Here's amount of plates per ore for lead, that you can get using all the technologies of "lead processing..." research: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.4 pl/ore; lp02- 0.5 pl/ore; lp03- 0.55 pl/ore; lp04-0.575 pl/ore. (if I miscalculated something, I'm sorry )
Going all the way from "lg03" to "lg04" technologies results only in 0.025 lead plates per ore (only 1 plate profit from 40 ore pieces).
Something similar happens with nickel (unfortunately I didn't test all other metals yet).
It's somehow realistic, but is not optimal in game point of view. There is no point in making all this beautiful machines and technological schemes as of right now. I think it would be better to buff mid and high grade technologies (at least for lead and nickel). Maybe change it to make more profit with better grades? (lead for example: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.2 pl/ore; lp02- 0.3 pl/ore; lp03- 0.45 pl/ore; lp04-0.65 pl/ore)

3) Looks like this charts are outdated: viewtopic.php?f=219&t=61835

PS all calculations were carried out using only full PyMods pack and FNEI.

first lead chain and chrome are exceptions since at high tier you get 2 metals so at low mied you get just one

make math based on 100 input pls or 120 ( 3 blue belts since decimals are hard to follow)
i have been helping py balance chains but process is slow and we didnt do those chais yet
also for some products both direct smelting and melting is available and not sometimes one is better the the other
and yes i also did similar math and found some problems

I'm planning to make table of plate production for all metals where I would point all things I think could be improved. It will show all semi-products and how many plates you can make on each level of ore processing at max using 500 ores. Right now iron, copper and tin are done. However it takes time, so I want to ask - would this tables be of use for you? If so - I'll gladly share it when it is done.

[immortal_sniper1]

hi and thank you for great mods!
There are some things I found strange.
*Warning* here goes wall of text (sorry for my bad English)
1) How does metal grades work? Some metals become better with grades, some not. Here's amount of plates I can get from metals of different grades, assuming that I have all the technologies but refuse to use metals of higher grades:
Lead:___raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 2 pl.| Grade2- 1 pl.| Grade3- 1 pl.
Iron:____raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 3 pl.| Grade2- 3 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.
Copper:_raw- 0.1 pl.| Grade1- 0 pl.| Grade2- 2 pl.| Grade3- 0.25 pl.| Grade4- 8.33 pl.
Nickel:__raw- 0.15 pl.| Grade1- 0.4 pl.| Grade2- 0 pl.| Grade3- 3 pl.| Grade4- 15pl.*

2) Some metal processing researches does not give any reasonable profit. Here's amount of plates per ore for lead, that you can get using all the technologies of "lead processing..." research: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.4 pl/ore; lp02- 0.5 pl/ore; lp03- 0.55 pl/ore; lp04-0.575 pl/ore. (if I miscalculated something, I'm sorry )
Going all the way from "lg03" to "lg04" technologies results only in 0.025 lead plates per ore (only 1 plate profit from 40 ore pieces).
Something similar happens with nickel (unfortunately I didn't test all other metals yet).
It's somehow realistic, but is not optimal in game point of view. There is no point in making all this beautiful machines and technological schemes as of right now. I think it would be better to buff mid and high grade technologies (at least for lead and nickel). Maybe change it to make more profit with better grades? (lead for example: lp00- 0.15* pl/ore; lp01- 0.2 pl/ore; lp02- 0.3 pl/ore; lp03- 0.45 pl/ore; lp04-0.65 pl/ore)

3) Looks like this charts are outdated: viewtopic.php?f=219&t=61835

PS all calculations were carried out using only full PyMods pack and FNEI.

first lead chain and chrome are exceptions since at high tier you get 2 metals so at low mied you get just one

make math based on 100 input pls or 120 ( 3 blue belts since decimals are hard to follow)
i have been helping py balance chains but process is slow and we didnt do those chais yet
also for some products both direct smelting and melting is available and not sometimes one is better the the other
and yes i also did similar math and found some problems

I'm planning to make table of plate production for all metals where I would point all things I think could be improved. It will show all semi-products and how many plates you can make on each level of ore processing at max using 500 ores. Right now iron, copper and tin are done. However it takes time, so I want to ask - would this tables be of use for you? If so - I'll gladly share it when it is done.

we actualy balance stuff that way we make a table graph and calculate
also tell me what do you think about the nexelite and tin , zinc chains balance since they were rebalanced recently
also keep in mind that chrome also produces gold and lead also produces silver

[pyanodon]

yes...we did recently a balance on nexelit, zinc and tin. I think iron and copper are ok. Coal are out since its just beneficiation.

[SuperSandro2000]

Salt concentration would be more constant than vary. If we have a salt concentration of 3% we would get around 300 mg per Liter. 1000 water are one liter and I assume one piece of salt is 100 mg then we should get exactly one salt from 300 water.

[aklesey1]

I have balance question about iron chain
6 raw iron gives 1 plate
2 iron oxide gives 1 plate

When using Helmod I came to the conclusion that iron oxide is more profitable to smelt on the plates than to use them in iron chain

May be here poeple already disscussed balance questions - too much reading, too much text, pls sorry

I'm looking on iron slime recipe and 20 iron oxide which'll give 1 plate its some dearly may be its can be 10 iron oxide or may be increase output yield? Or if 6 raw iron ore gives 1 plate, 4 iron oxide can give 1 plate not 2 iron oxide? With this change iron oxide will not suffer bcuz we have many ways to get it even in begiging of the game
Just remeber that we'll need any science packs 1 to open crusher technology and iron smelting stage 1

The production of iron-oxide isnt enough to keep a base. it´s a side product and there´s no specific recipe for it, except in pyHT.

it is conceived that the melting of iron oxide in less profitable than smelting iron ore?

Iron slime.png (134.99 KiB) Viewed 5053 times

For what this recipe was created? With the release of the update you have reduced the chances of obtaining iron oxide and now its more rare resource and using iron oxide for iron slime makes me bewilderment
I can produce iron slime from iron dust ore its more profitable for now
Then it doesn't make much sense and benefit - we need too many iron oxide to produce iron slime - i agree that i'll need to produce many iron oxide to keep that production, but if i'll want to produce many many iron oxide i'll find the way to do it

Just imagine that i have surplus of iron oxide and want smelt it i have 2 varianrts:
1) Smelt it in common furnace and get more plates
2) Get iron slime from it by combining with tailings water and get less iron plates from smelting unslimed iron

Another part of iron chain works good when smelting iron ore
But i have suggestion - if we need 6 pieces of iron ore to 1 iron in common furnace plate may be we need 6 iron oxide for 1 iron plate in common furnace (not 2 iron oxide for 1 iron plate) - this change will make shift to ideal balance in iron chain