[0.18] Need suggestions/feedback for a WIP reskin mod...

[bobingabout]

Needs more work, but as an idea I think it has merit.

As for a concept to distinguish the Large Area mining drills...


I'm not sure I like it. Hm.

the electrolyser looks good.
the mining drill... the animation works, but the travel time doesn't seem to be enough, so it looks odd because both sets of drills seem to barely move.

[kirazy]

Sometimes the simple solution is best, I think. They just need to be visually separable:

[bobingabout]

Sometimes the simple solution is best, I think. They just need to be visually separable:

yeah, it works.

[kirazy]

Thoughts?



Also, I don't think there is a quantitative difference in the effective max pump speed between your pumps.

I have them all draining one full water tank directly, and dumping into a tank whose contents are being instantly voided again with direct connection.

Transfer speed maxes out at 6000/s for pump-2, pump-3, and pump-4 inspite of being 7200, 9600, and 12000. The 6000/s is only reachable if the source tank is maxed and the destination tank is empty, otherwise it only asymptotically approaches 6000, doesn't actually reach it.

Direct feeding with a fluid source generating at 10k/s into a void gets 8400/s out of the Pump-4, but... what's the setup that gets you max pump throughput? I'm not sure it's reachable; may want to rescale the pumps throughput.

Edit:

Also, an idea of a kitbash for the various valves:


I'm using the pump from the steam engine, so I was thinking of having it at different positions for the three different valves in addition to the arrow.

E.g. Fully open for the generic valve,

Slightly open for input > 80% (to convey the flow is constrained so that the input can fill up, for example)

Mostly open for output < 20%? Idk.

Also easy enough to just not bother with that and just have one kitbash + arrows...

[bobingabout]

Thoughts?



Also, I don't think there is a quantitative difference in the effective max pump speed between your pumps.

I have them all draining one full water tank directly, and dumping into a tank whose contents are being instantly voided again with direct connection.

Transfer speed maxes out at 6000/s for pump-2, pump-3, and pump-4 inspite of being 7200, 9600, and 12000. The 6000/s is only reachable if the source tank is maxed and the destination tank is empty, otherwise it only asymptotically approaches 6000, doesn't actually reach it.

Direct feeding with a fluid source generating at 10k/s into a void gets 8400/s out of the Pump-4, but... what's the setup that gets you max pump throughput? I'm not sure it's reachable; may want to rescale the pumps throughput.

Someone pointed out to me that the base game valve has been changed. I have applied that change to my pumps so that their speed should max out at 12000 instead of 6000, but haven't released yet.
Artwork looks good though.

Also, an idea of a kitbash for the various valves:


I'm using the pump from the steam engine, so I was thinking of having it at different positions for the three different valves in addition to the arrow.

E.g. Fully open for the generic valve,

Slightly open for input > 80% (to convey the flow is constrained so that the input can fill up, for example)

Mostly open for output < 20%? Idk.

Also easy enough to just not bother with that and just have one kitbash + arrows...

The valves, I'm not sure what I was thinking for the 1 way part, but I'm fairly sure i was thinking of a simple membrane valve. flowing one way, the membrane is pushed out, and the fluid flows around it, going the other way the membrane is pushed against the seal, and stops the flow...
I'm just trying to think if all the extra gadgets attached to the pipe is necessary.

Anyway, the underflow/overflow parts are simply just part of the pipe being blocked off. Overflow meaning only the top 20% of the pipe is open, Underflow meaning only the bottom 20% of the pipe is open.
It's a bit harder to justify how this works in an with gasses as this would just fill the pipe behind the blockage, but if you assume water in an airtight pipe, the logic works.

I mean, the graphics are okay, I've just never imagined it before as anything more than just a pipe with some gubbins inside it.

[kirazy]

The valves, I'm not sure what I was thinking for the 1 way part, but I'm fairly sure i was thinking of a simple membrane valve. flowing one way, the membrane is pushed out, and the fluid flows around it, going the other way the membrane is pushed against the seal, and stops the flow...
I'm just trying to think if all the extra gadgets attached to the pipe is necessary.

Anyway, the underflow/overflow parts are simply just part of the pipe being blocked off. Overflow meaning only the top 20% of the pipe is open, Underflow meaning only the bottom 20% of the pipe is open.
It's a bit harder to justify how this works in an with gasses as this would just fill the pipe behind the blockage, but if you assume water in an airtight pipe, the logic works.

I mean, the graphics are okay, I've just never imagined it before as anything more than just a pipe with some gubbins inside it.

I think the underflow/overflow pipes wouldn't work as described in a real system, and I don't think a passive valve of that design would make sense in the Factorio context either, since stuff seems to fill up without really worrying about air in the system compressing and preventing full fill, so probably an air release so stuff just fills.

But I'm picturing a reservoir (tank) with fluid height well above the height the pipe, connected via passive valve to an empty reservoir, I don't think the location or size of the opening in the valve will do much to prevent the tank from emptying until the two tanks have equal volume.

You'd need active valve control if you want flow to occur only for input 80% full, or output under 20% full*. I don't think you can do it with passive valves.

From one pipe to the next it may work as described in the overflow case, but I don't think it would work as described in the underflow case.

Edit: I will say I don't think my idea works well, it's too busy. Will try something else.

*Active valve control for the way factorio pipes are depicted as connecting to tanks, etc. IRL you could get away with it depending on where you hook the pipes to your reservoir, but in Factorio they're all hooked at the base.

Edit 2: Roboport took a bit longer than I expected:


I underestimated the number of miscellaneous parts...

[bobingabout]

I think the underflow/overflow pipes wouldn't work as described in a real system

Depends on certain conditions.
I did base the original ideas that I mentioned on IRL devices.
Overflow, where the the fluid only goes over the block if it raises above a certain level works in most cases, but only with liquids. Sealed but not compressed, and open to the environment. the only case it doesn't work is presurised.
Underflow again only works on liquids, and only works if Gasses can't flow from one side to the other once the fluid is high enough to reach the block, meaning at least one side needs to be sealed. a real world example, a bottle full of water with no cap on, upside down in a bowel of water. the water will remain in the bottle until the level of water in the bowel falls low enough that air can flow up into the bottle, at which point the water falls from the bottle to let air in, but once the level in the bowel reaches the opening of the bottle, the flow stops again.
But considering the fluid system in factorio can be either fluid filled, and it isn't specified if sealed or not, AND it can contain pressurised gasses (Steam by default), then its likely that even the overflow valve isn't guaranteed to work.

Edit 2: Roboport took a bit longer than I expected:


I underestimated the number of miscellaneous parts...

Looks good. The door on the highest tier may be a bit on the dark side, looks more like tungsten than nitinol.
My only real issue though, is with tiering. in theory the first roboport (made with Steel, a T2 material) is T2, and therefore should be Red, not yellow.

I actually use some graphics made by Zombiee in my mod that start at red. (You may have to turn on colour overhaul to see them, I don't remember)

[kirazy]

My only real issue though, is with tiering. in theory the first roboport (made with Steel, a T2 material) is T2, and therefore should be Red, not yellow.

I know, I took the screenshot using what I'm calling "Name" mapping. I have a drop-down option to choose either "Name" or "Ingredient" mapped, and ingredient mapped is the one that corresponds to your design intent. So basically images exist for every entity for tiers 1-5, whether there are 5 entities or not, and the option you select determines what gets used.

Code: Select all

if settings.startup["reskin-series-tier-mapping"].value == "name-map" then
    tier_map =
    {
        ["roboport"]       = {1,1},
        ["bob-roboport-2"] = {2,2},
        ["bob-roboport-3"] = {3,3},
        ["bob-roboport-4"] = {4,4}
    }
else
    tier_map =
    {
        ["roboport"]       = {2,1},
        ["bob-roboport-2"] = {3,2},
        ["bob-roboport-3"] = {4,3},
        ["bob-roboport-4"] = {5,4}
    }
end

So switching to ingredient mapped:


Edit: I've tweaked the door colors; removed some of the intense blue from the titanium and tried a different method for NItinol.

[bobingabout]

My only real issue though, is with tiering. in theory the first roboport (made with Steel, a T2 material) is T2, and therefore should be Red, not yellow.

I know, I took the screenshot using what I'm calling "Name" mapping. I have a drop-down option to choose either "Name" or "Ingredient" mapped, and ingredient mapped is the one that corresponds to your design intent. So basically images exist for every entity for tiers 1-5, whether there are 5 entities or not, and the option you select determines what gets used.

Code: Select all

if settings.startup["reskin-series-tier-mapping"].value == "name-map" then
    tier_map =
    {
        ["roboport"]       = {1,1},
        ["bob-roboport-2"] = {2,2},
        ["bob-roboport-3"] = {3,3},
        ["bob-roboport-4"] = {4,4}
    }
else
    tier_map =
    {
        ["roboport"]       = {2,1},
        ["bob-roboport-2"] = {3,2},
        ["bob-roboport-3"] = {4,3},
        ["bob-roboport-4"] = {5,4}
    }
end

So switching to ingredient mapped:


Edit: I've tweaked the door colors; removed some of the intense blue from the titanium and tried a different method for NItinol.

I see.

if you want I can send you graphics for my robochests that don't have the door merged into them.
Also, you could just use my door graphics instead of redrawing them.

[kirazy]

if you want I can send you graphics for my robochests that don't have the door merged into them.

I think I'm going to rebuild the robochest graphics using the 0.17 logistics chests as a base, so it's not necessary.

Also, you could just use my door graphics instead of redrawing them.

Let me try this; my one issue was that I didn't like that the rim is colored too, you lose out on the rust/corrosion colors, but then recoloring those to match what the corrosion looks like on nitinol/titanium/invar is a pain...



On the subject of graphics though, where did you get the Zone Expander sprites?

Edit: Alright, the rim kind of grew on me. I've taken a stab at it:
I've left in some of the color for Invar/Nitinol but Titanium pretty much only corrodes under very specific circumstances as no corrosion is fine:


Edit 2: I discovered an issue, haven't done any digging into what's going on, but:

For your Roboport entities the bot gets consumed before it's animation docking is complete. The issue is that your

Code: Select all

spawn_and_station_height = 0.33

when on the base roboport it's

Code: Select all

spawn_and_station_height = -0.1

[bobingabout]

For your Roboport entities the bot gets consumed before it's animation docking is complete. The issue is that your

Code: Select all

spawn_and_station_height = 0.33

when on the base roboport it's

Code: Select all

spawn_and_station_height = -0.1

I'll fix that.

[kirazy]

Color the dish or no?

(Also, do you have a non-colored Zone Expander sprite?)

[bobingabout]

Color the dish or no?

(Also, do you have a non-colored Zone Expander sprite?)

I think it looks fine without being coloured.

the LZE was originally done by... how do you spell his name, Yuoki.
This is the original graphic he sent me: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7pszl3vt5agt8 ... r.png?dl=0
I deleted the shadow https://www.dropbox.com/s/6lorotvtwko8ph9/lze.png?dl=0 then added a new one (by rotating the entity 90 degrees and making it solid black, with semi-transparancy later. if I were to do that now I'd just keep the solid black version as a shadow layer) https://www.dropbox.com/s/6ukbg6szfd2ca ... 1.png?dl=0 (this version is missing the charge pad because I was using an animated chargepad layer.)
As you can see, it originally had a charging pad on top. I removed that because it no longer does in the code, and edited it to be a point to fit the spinning antenna on top.

Fairly sure the MK1 is just the uncoloured sprite, which is one reason why I didn't link it. (the other reason being it isn't in my dropbox archive to link)

[kirazy]

I think it looks fine without being coloured.

That was my feeling too. I had planned to color the dish but when I finished the non-moving parts I wasn't feeling it.

the LZE was originally done by... how do you spell his name, Yuoki.
This is the original graphic he sent me: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7pszl3vt5agt8 ... r.png?dl=0
I deleted the shadow https://www.dropbox.com/s/6lorotvtwko8ph9/lze.png?dl=0 then added a new one (by rotating the entity 90 degrees and making it solid black, with semi-transparancy later. if I were to do that now I'd just keep the solid black version as a shadow layer) https://www.dropbox.com/s/6ukbg6szfd2ca ... 1.png?dl=0 (this version is missing the charge pad because I was using an animated chargepad layer.)
As you can see, it originally had a charging pad on top. I removed that because it no longer does in the code, and edited it to be a point to fit the spinning antenna on top.

Fairly sure the MK1 is just the uncoloured sprite, which is one reason why I didn't link it. (the other reason being it isn't in my dropbox archive to link)

Youki is still around, possible for him to re-render a HR version?

[bobingabout]

the LZE was originally done by... how do you spell his name, Yuoki.
This is the original graphic he sent me: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7pszl3vt5agt8 ... r.png?dl=0
I deleted the shadow https://www.dropbox.com/s/6lorotvtwko8ph9/lze.png?dl=0 then added a new one (by rotating the entity 90 degrees and making it solid black, with semi-transparancy later. if I were to do that now I'd just keep the solid black version as a shadow layer) https://www.dropbox.com/s/6ukbg6szfd2ca ... 1.png?dl=0 (this version is missing the charge pad because I was using an animated chargepad layer.)
As you can see, it originally had a charging pad on top. I removed that because it no longer does in the code, and edited it to be a point to fit the spinning antenna on top.

Fairly sure the MK1 is just the uncoloured sprite, which is one reason why I didn't link it. (the other reason being it isn't in my dropbox archive to link)

Youki is still around, possible for him to re-render a HR version?

Ask him if you want. I think Zombiee was working on a HD version of it.

[kirazy]

Ask him if you want. I think Zombiee was working on a HD version of it.

I'll ask him.

Too bright?

[bobingabout]

Ask him if you want. I think Zombiee was working on a HD version of it.

I'll ask him.

Too bright?

hmmm... Maybe a little. Turn down the saturation a little?

I've actually had a few people throw recoloured purple walls at me, or just ask to have them updated as a new recolour.
I purposely kept the old ones so that they look different.
I do however praise any attempts by others to do it.

[kirazy]

I was going to color more, but I'm happy with this for the Laser turrets.

I tweaked your beams, as well. Diamond is now substantially more intense/brighter than glass:


Edit: And finished these, at last:


Edit 2:


With or without the middle ring? I think without is better, but it's substantially more work, lol. On consideration it's like 10 times the amount of work to do 2 rings, so 3 it is... the quest is do you think the barrels are long enough?

or

Personally, it's more at home in the gun-turret base, and the longer barrel helps to distinguish it.

[bobingabout]

I was going to color more, but I'm happy with this for the Laser turrets.

I tweaked your beams, as well. Diamond is now substantially more intense/brighter than glass:


Edit: And finished these, at last:


Edit 2:


With or without the middle ring? I think without is better, but it's substantially more work, lol. On consideration it's like 10 times the amount of work to do 2 rings, so 3 it is... the quest is do you think the barrels are long enough?

or

Personally, it's more at home in the gun-turret base, and the longer barrel helps to distinguish it.

Lasers do look good, I noticed it's just a colour on the base, not the moving gun part, but that's okay, the base should be enough.

Finished gun looks good.
Sniper with the longer barrel does make it look better.

Which base? I mean, sure it does seem more at home on the gun turret base, because it IS a gun turret, but I used the laser base to try and make it look more unique.
The longer barrel could be enough, but I guess it also depends on if there's anything else distinctive enough on it to help make you spot the difference at a glance.
You actually have a 3rd option, make something new. it doesn't even have to be significantly different from the gun turret base.

[kirazy]

With some ideas from Deadlock, I have a workflow for proper color masks that preserve the highlights. Now to make those for the entities I've done so far. I'll get you a new chemical plant mask, which should be much improved from what I gave you.

Photoshop masks


Initial mask


Luminosity-derived masks


Added the ability to tweak the tier colors with hex codes: