Version 0.15.11

[quadrox]

On a 4k monitor, it's now painfully close in map view. Noticeable to the point where you're zoomed in far closer then you'd naturally be zoomed in (IE: far closer then you'd be zoomed in, when playing without being in map mode).

[edit]I should clarify, on a *large* 4k monitor (IE: 43")[/edit]

Same here, I am really hoping the devs will fix this or make it possible to research a fix.

[jessjade]

[*]Achievements should no longer be unlocked when replaying a game. (47151)

been waiting for that thank you, great job

[eX_ploit]

I like that design. Any chance for a blueprint string?

Yep, sorry I forgot to do it back then.

Code: Select all

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

Just add a roboport(only one bot is required) and 6 pipes of water.

There's a similar one (that I've verified works to 480MW) here.

That one doesn't include a fuel throttling system, but mine does.

[DuoMog]

I've just noticed an inconsistency between two achievements...
"Lazy Barsteward" says I have crafted 0 items manually, but
"You're doing it right" says I have crafted 2 items manually.

This is at the start of a new game, where I haven't constructed anything, but I have placed the miner drill and furnace that are provided to the player


Another random thought:-
"Smoke me a kipper" and "There is no spoon" - Can these ever be achieved under the 0.15 version of Factorio?

[daniel34]

I've just noticed an inconsistency between two achievements...
"Lazy Barsteward" says I have crafted 0 items manually, but
"You're doing it right" says I have crafted 2 items manually.

This is at the start of a new game, where I haven't constructed anything, but I have placed the miner drill and furnace that are provided to the player

The "You are doing it right" achievement is about placing down (building) items, so 2 is correct after you placed the mining drill and furnace.

Another random thought:-
"Smoke me a kipper" and "There is no spoon" - Can these ever be achieved under the 0.15 version of Factorio?

"Smoke me a kipper" is just for launching a rocket, so yes. "There is no spoon" adds an 8 hour time limit, which is also possible (although difficult) in 0.15.

[Taipion]

That one doesn't include a fuel throttling system, but mine does.

Why would you need that many combinators just for a fuel management system?

[edit:]
Also, I see you just used 4 pumps, do the storage tanks fill up nicely like that?
I had to use tons of pumps in my setup to make sure the tanks are filled to the top whenever possible.

[Rialla]

The zoom level at which the map switches from 'map view' to 'world view' was increased.

Please revert this change or add option to configure the distance. All the functionality is gone, placing large blueprints is impossible now.

[eX_ploit]

That one doesn't include a fuel throttling system, but mine does.

Why would you need that many combinators just for a fuel management system?

To account for everything that can go wrong.(Also space that is filled by combinators was wasted anyway)
It checks for 3 conditions before inserting fuel:
1. Steam is less than half full.
2. There is nuclear fuel in all of the feeding chests at the same time.
3. 200 seconds have passed since the last feeding.

[edit:]
Also, I see you just used 4 pumps, do the storage tanks fill up nicely like that?
I had to use tons of pumps in my setup to make sure the tanks are filled to the top whenever possible.

Lol, where did you see pumps in my setup? I didn't use them at all(except offshore pumps).[EDIT]I think you confused my design with the other one.

do the storage tanks fill up nicely like that?

Yes they do. Fueling happens when tanks are less than 50%, and one fuel cycle fills them by 80%, so extra 30% gets stored as heat in the reactors themselves + heatpipes. 50% threshold is required to prevent steam pressure issues, otherwise steam won't reach turbines fast enough.

[Taipion]

That one doesn't include a fuel throttling system, but mine does.

Why would you need that many combinators just for a fuel management system?

To account for everything that can go wrong.(Also space that is filled by combinators was wasted anyway)
It checks for 3 conditions before inserting fuel:
1. Steam is less than half full.
2. There is nuclear fuel in all of the feeding chests at the same time.
3. 200 seconds have passed since the last feeding.

Well, if you just cicuit the inputting inserter to the outputting inserter, you got 200 seconds covered.
The fuel condition is actually good, I have not thought of that, but I guess for my setup it is unlikely for that to go wrong, ever.

[edit:]
Also, I see you just used 4 pumps, do the storage tanks fill up nicely like that?
I had to use tons of pumps in my setup to make sure the tanks are filled to the top whenever possible.

Lol, where did you see pumps in my setup? I didn't use them at all(except offshore pumps).

In the list of items used in the BP it says 4 pumps.

do the storage tanks fill up nicely like that?

Yes they do. Fueling happens when tanks are less than 50%, and one fuel cycle fills them by 80%, so extra 30% gets stored as heat in the reactors themselves + heatpipes. 50% threshold is required to prevent steam pressure issues, otherwise steam won't reach turbines fast enough.

I know those pressure issues when steam storage goes low, but my setup (with arguably many more storage tanks and a bigger reactor) I had massive problems with the steam only filling up till 70-80% at max, especially if there was more than 50% load on the system, meaning the turbines outputted 50%+ of what the heat exchangers could provide.
I ended up using many pumps, to the storage tanks, and in between storage tank segments, that did the trick and now they fill up nicely to the max.

Do your tanks fill up to the top without pumps?

[eX_ploit]

Do your tanks fill up to the top without pumps?

Yes they do, so long as you draw much less power then reactors are producing, but they don't stay full all the time, they go back and forth between being full and half, as the fuel cycle goes.

I know those pressure issues when steam storage goes low, but my setup (with arguably many more storage tanks and a bigger reactor) I had massive problems with the steam only filling up till 70-80% at max, especially if there was more than 50% load on the system, meaning the turbines outputted 50%+ of what the heat exchangers could provide.
I ended up using many pumps, to the storage tanks, and in between storage tank segments, that did the trick and now they fill up nicely to the max.

Actually tanks not filling up with big energy consumption makes sense, and I fail to see how adding pumps helps there. Let's say that nuclear reaction starts when tanks are at 50%, and one reaction fills them by 80%. 50% + 80% = 130%, so they should be more then filled, right? Well, no, because if you at the same time draw half of that energy, then 80% gets cut in half, and 50% + 40% = 90%. so these tanks will never fill to full, and adding pumps won't fix that. And if you draw all of the energy of reactor then tanks will forever be stuck at 50%

Well, if you just cicuit the inputting inserter to the outputting inserter, you got 200 seconds covered.

Yeah, this timer is from the times when reactor was outputting used fuel cells immediately. But I don't think that getting rid of it will reduce combinator count that much.

The fuel condition is actually good, I have not thought of that, but I guess for my setup it is unlikely for that to go wrong, ever.

Famous last words.

In the list of items used in the BP it says 4 pumps.

I think you confused my design with the other one, my doesn't have 4 pumps

[Killcreek2]

The zoom level at which the map switches from 'map view' to 'world view' was increased.

New zoom level is just right, the first [larger view] was far too OP, and a painful hit on the UPS at that level. Thanks devs!

Please revert this change or add option to configure the distance. All the functionality is gone, placing large blueprints is impossible now.

"All the functionality" is still there, *except* for placing humongous blueprints remotely. Just use smaller ones or travel there in person...
Though a config option would be nice to have, so everyone can tailor it to their personal preference.

[Taipion]

Actually tanks not filling up with big energy consumption makes sense, and I fail to see how adding pumps helps there. Let's say that nuclear reaction starts when tanks are at 50%, and one reaction fills them by 80%. 50% + 80% = 130%, so they should be more then filled, right? Well, no, because if you at the same time draw half of that energy, then 80% gets cut in half, and 50% + 40% = 90%. so these tanks will never fill to full, and adding pumps won't fix that. And if you draw all of the energy of reactor then tanks will forever be stuck at 50%

Your math is a little off, the current filling of the tanks should not matter, and with pumps it actually does not matter.
If you produce more steam than you consume, the tanks should fill, without pumps though, and maybe due to the size of my storage tank array, it did in fact not fill as the steam from the heat exchangers did not manage to generate enough pressure it seems.

Well, now that I do use pumps, my tanks do fill up to full if I manually switch on the reactors for more than is needed (constant combinator).

My design puts it in this way: heat exchangers to storage tanks to steam turbines.
Without pumps, and say 50% load (steam turbines consuming 50% of what the heat exchangers can produce) it would never fill above 70-80%,
it also looks like the flow within storage tank arrays is kind of bad, I don't know how to word that in a descriptive way.

But with a ton of pumps, it fills all up to the top (99-98%) easily.
For that I segmented the storage tank array in 3 parts and have pumps on all connections between these parts, so the 3rd and last part directly in front of the steam turbines will always be full to the top, and therefore provide full steam for the turbines even if the storage tank array is in total only at 25% or so.
With more reactor heat added, the other segments also fill up nicely to the top as there are further pumps from the heat exchangers to the storage tank segments and as I said in between segments.

Due to this personal experience I just wondered if/how your storage tanks manage to fill up without pumps.

[eX_ploit]

Actually tanks not filling up with big energy consumption makes sense, and I fail to see how adding pumps helps there. Let's say that nuclear reaction starts when tanks are at 50%, and one reaction fills them by 80%. 50% + 80% = 130%, so they should be more then filled, right? Well, no, because if you at the same time draw half of that energy, then 80% gets cut in half, and 50% + 40% = 90%. so these tanks will never fill to full, and adding pumps won't fix that. And if you draw all of the energy of reactor then tanks will forever be stuck at 50%

Your math is a little off, the current filling of the tanks should not matter, and with pumps it actually does not matter.
If you produce more steam than you consume, the tanks should fill, without pumps though, and maybe due to the size of my storage tank array, it did in fact not fill as the steam from the heat exchangers did not manage to generate enough pressure it seems.

Well, now that I do use pumps, my tanks do fill up to full if I manually switch on the reactors for more than is needed (constant combinator).

My design puts it in this way: heat exchangers to storage tanks to steam turbines.
Without pumps, and say 50% load (steam turbines consuming 50% of what the heat exchangers can produce) it would never fill above 70-80%,
it also looks like the flow within storage tank arrays is kind of bad, I don't know how to word that in a descriptive way.

But with a ton of pumps, it fills all up to the top (99-98%) easily.
For that I segmented the storage tank array in 3 parts and have pumps on all connections between these parts, so the 3rd and last part directly in front of the steam turbines will always be full to the top, and therefore provide full steam for the turbines even if the storage tank array is in total only at 25% or so.
With more reactor heat added, the other segments also fill up nicely to the top as there are further pumps from the heat exchangers to the storage tank segments and as I said in between segments.

Due to this personal experience I just wondered if/how your storage tanks manage to fill up without pumps.

Your math is off, not mine. It does matter how much tanks are filled before you insert fuel(you never mentioned what's your threshold btw), and it does matter how much tanks you have compared to heat exchangers(you also didn't mention this). When number of tanks is equal to number of exchangers, then one fuel cycle fills these tanks by 80% each. That's assuming no steam consumption. If you were also consuming half of the steam you were producing, then those tanks will only be filled by 40% each. So in this configuration tanks won't be filled even though you are producing more steam than you consume.(Because you are not producing steam all of the time, steam gets produced only when you are low on steam, which is the point of fuel throttling)

[Taipion]

Actually tanks not filling up with big energy consumption makes sense, and I fail to see how adding pumps helps there. Let's say that nuclear reaction starts when tanks are at 50%, and one reaction fills them by 80%. 50% + 80% = 130%, so they should be more then filled, right? Well, no, because if you at the same time draw half of that energy, then 80% gets cut in half, and 50% + 40% = 90%. so these tanks will never fill to full, and adding pumps won't fix that. And if you draw all of the energy of reactor then tanks will forever be stuck at 50%

Your math is a little off, the current filling of the tanks should not matter, and with pumps it actually does not matter.
If you produce more steam than you consume, the tanks should fill, without pumps though, and maybe due to the size of my storage tank array, it did in fact not fill as the steam from the heat exchangers did not manage to generate enough pressure it seems.

Well, now that I do use pumps, my tanks do fill up to full if I manually switch on the reactors for more than is needed (constant combinator).

My design puts it in this way: heat exchangers to storage tanks to steam turbines.
Without pumps, and say 50% load (steam turbines consuming 50% of what the heat exchangers can produce) it would never fill above 70-80%,
it also looks like the flow within storage tank arrays is kind of bad, I don't know how to word that in a descriptive way.

But with a ton of pumps, it fills all up to the top (99-98%) easily.
For that I segmented the storage tank array in 3 parts and have pumps on all connections between these parts, so the 3rd and last part directly in front of the steam turbines will always be full to the top, and therefore provide full steam for the turbines even if the storage tank array is in total only at 25% or so.
With more reactor heat added, the other segments also fill up nicely to the top as there are further pumps from the heat exchangers to the storage tank segments and as I said in between segments.

Due to this personal experience I just wondered if/how your storage tanks manage to fill up without pumps.

Your math is off, not mine. It does matter how much tanks are filled before you insert fuel(you never mentioned what's your threshold btw), and it does matter how much tanks you have compared to heat exchangers(you also didn't mention this). When number of tanks is equal to number of exchangers, then one fuel cycle fills these tanks by 80% each. That's assuming no steam consumption. If you were also consuming half of the steam you were producing, then those tanks will only be filled by 40% each. So in this configuration tanks won't be filled even though you are producing more steam than you consume.(Because you are not producing steam all of the time, steam gets produced only when you are low on steam, which is the point of fuel throttling)

No, your math is off, not mine.

As I said, it is simple, if I (as I said) turn on the reactor permanently, and power consumption is only half of what the exchangers can produce (reactor output and heat is sufficient for that), then the storage tanks usually won't go above 50%, not on short term and not on long term, while the heat pipes sit at 900+° (in 0.15.9).
It will partly go so low that the steam turbines cant even run at full power if I increase the load, the storage tanks in between heat exchangers and steam turbines just behave strange on their own.
But, (again, as I said), if I simply put a ton of pumps in between everything (as I did), it's all good and in the same situation with the same load, tanks will fill to the top.

[eX_ploit]

Actually tanks not filling up with big energy consumption makes sense, and I fail to see how adding pumps helps there. Let's say that nuclear reaction starts when tanks are at 50%, and one reaction fills them by 80%. 50% + 80% = 130%, so they should be more then filled, right? Well, no, because if you at the same time draw half of that energy, then 80% gets cut in half, and 50% + 40% = 90%. so these tanks will never fill to full, and adding pumps won't fix that. And if you draw all of the energy of reactor then tanks will forever be stuck at 50%

Your math is a little off, the current filling of the tanks should not matter, and with pumps it actually does not matter.
If you produce more steam than you consume, the tanks should fill, without pumps though, and maybe due to the size of my storage tank array, it did in fact not fill as the steam from the heat exchangers did not manage to generate enough pressure it seems.

Well, now that I do use pumps, my tanks do fill up to full if I manually switch on the reactors for more than is needed (constant combinator).

My design puts it in this way: heat exchangers to storage tanks to steam turbines.
Without pumps, and say 50% load (steam turbines consuming 50% of what the heat exchangers can produce) it would never fill above 70-80%,
it also looks like the flow within storage tank arrays is kind of bad, I don't know how to word that in a descriptive way.

But with a ton of pumps, it fills all up to the top (99-98%) easily.
For that I segmented the storage tank array in 3 parts and have pumps on all connections between these parts, so the 3rd and last part directly in front of the steam turbines will always be full to the top, and therefore provide full steam for the turbines even if the storage tank array is in total only at 25% or so.
With more reactor heat added, the other segments also fill up nicely to the top as there are further pumps from the heat exchangers to the storage tank segments and as I said in between segments.

Due to this personal experience I just wondered if/how your storage tanks manage to fill up without pumps.

Your math is off, not mine. It does matter how much tanks are filled before you insert fuel(you never mentioned what's your threshold btw), and it does matter how much tanks you have compared to heat exchangers(you also didn't mention this). When number of tanks is equal to number of exchangers, then one fuel cycle fills these tanks by 80% each. That's assuming no steam consumption. If you were also consuming half of the steam you were producing, then those tanks will only be filled by 40% each. So in this configuration tanks won't be filled even though you are producing more steam than you consume.(Because you are not producing steam all of the time, steam gets produced only when you are low on steam, which is the point of fuel throttling)

No, your math is off, not mine.

As I said, it is simple, if I (as I said) turn on the reactor permanently, and power consumption is only half of what the exchangers can produce (reactor output and heat is sufficient for that), then the storage tanks usually won't go above 50%, not on short term and not on long term, while the heat pipes sit at 900+° (in 0.15.9).
It will partly go so low that the steam turbines cant even run at full power if I increase the load, the storage tanks in between heat exchangers and steam turbines just behave strange on their own.
But, (again, as I said), if I simply put a ton of pumps in between everything (as I did), it's all good and in the same situation with the same load, tanks will fill to the top.

Okay, now I get it. My math wasn't off, I just didn't understand that you described "turn on the reactor permanently" situation. In that situation my tanks fill to full no problem without any pumps, before anything gets heated to even 550C. Further understanding of why your setup requires pumps would require screenshots of your design.

[malventano]

Tanks won't fill all the way if they are in the steam flow path as opposed to alongside it.

[Taipion]

Tanks won't fill all the way if they are in the steam flow path as opposed to alongside it.

1.) Yea, that seems to be what I was experiencing, is there any reason to this?

2.) if you use pumps in the right way, they will still fill up to 100% even if they are in the steam flow path.

[Bartimaeus]

Actually tanks not filling up ...

Your math is a little off ...

Your math is off, not mine. ...

No, your math is off, not mine. ...

Okay, now I get it. My math wasn't off, I just didn't understand that you described "turn on the reactor permanently" situation.

I "love it" when two people are arguing in this way because they simply cannot even agree on what they are arguing in the first place *facepalm*

[malventano]

Tanks won't fill all the way if they are in the steam flow path as opposed to alongside it.

1.) Yea, that seems to be what I was experiencing, is there any reason to this?

2.) if you use pumps in the right way, they will still fill up to 100% even if they are in the steam flow path.

It's just the way the 'passive' flow works through tanks. It's similar for pipes actually, but I think a tank counts as a few pipe tiles. The new pumps were designed specifically for rapid tank-to-tank transfer, so you can get some impressive flow there, especially if the tanks are coupled directly with a pump and no pipes at all.

[Taipion]

Tanks won't fill all the way if they are in the steam flow path as opposed to alongside it.

1.) Yea, that seems to be what I was experiencing, is there any reason to this?

2.) if you use pumps in the right way, they will still fill up to 100% even if they are in the steam flow path.

It's just the way the 'passive' flow works through tanks. It's similar for pipes actually, but I think a tank counts as a few pipe tiles. The new pumps were designed specifically for rapid tank-to-tank transfer, so you can get some impressive flow there, especially if the tanks are coupled directly with a pump and no pipes at all.

I see, I have assumed something like that, so me using tons of pumps in between tanks is actually doing it right?