Why is pY tuned for such slowness?

[Sopel]

Py has always been a balance nightmare since its inception. I've tried it three times over the years and ended up watching a movie while waiting for basic tasks to complete. The mod fits that 'good in concept, but bad execution' role.

You may encounter some "B-but.. It's difficult and complex!" delusionals who believe that improper balance is something to praise, but you're entirely correct in that it's an absolute snoozefest waiting for anything to get done. It's poor design and undoubtedly pushed away more people within the first few hours than any other mod. Angel/Bob adds a lot to the game yet it's the most carefully balanced set of mods that keep you engaged from the start and has a balanced progression curve throughout, that's why they're the most loved overhaul mods on the portal. Py could most certainly achieve that if the balance was much more solid and carefully planned out, but don't hold your breath on that as it's already been a couple years.

Perhaps someday.

This. Mostly it is ok, but there are some retarded recipes that make absolutely no sense or just cram everything that's possible into one item to the point of ridiculousnes. And it takes only one recipe to break the balance. Especially those that don't have alternatives and happen to be badly designed. Doesn't help that stuff like zipirs are a pain to get (or anything related to meat actually) and the only answer from py for that issue is "Wait for PyAL" (viewtopic.php?p=371668#p371668)... This is to date the worst answer from a mod developer i've seen. Some alloys also have weird recipes. Though as much as I hate how this mod is being developed I love PyHT (terrible desease) so much that I can't play without it now and I can take changing some retarded recipes as I go. And with AB and momo tweaks it seems at least a little bit better compared to the rest.
But PyRO is just retarded however you look at it. I went through the recipes to see how things go around and my conclusion is that the complexity and space required for next tiers completely negates the bigger gains.

[pyanodon]

So, dont play with the mods you dont like. Just because you dont like some of my decisions and think its "retarded", you can just disable it and play the ones you consider "ok".

Im kinda tired of people thinking me, nexela or kingarthur have to obey their orders or hear that our work is "retarded" like if it isnt a thing we do for free and optional for the community.

[immortal_sniper1]

Py has always been a balance nightmare since its inception. I've tried it three times over the years and ended up watching a movie while waiting for basic tasks to complete. The mod fits that 'good in concept, but bad execution' role.

You may encounter some "B-but.. It's difficult and complex!" delusionals who believe that improper balance is something to praise, but you're entirely correct in that it's an absolute snoozefest waiting for anything to get done. It's poor design and undoubtedly pushed away more people within the first few hours than any other mod. Angel/Bob adds a lot to the game yet it's the most carefully balanced set of mods that keep you engaged from the start and has a balanced progression curve throughout, that's why they're the most loved overhaul mods on the portal. Py could most certainly achieve that if the balance was much more solid and carefully planned out, but don't hold your breath on that as it's already been a couple years.

Perhaps someday.

This. Mostly it is ok, but there are some retarded recipes that make absolutely no sense or just cram everything that's possible into one item to the point of ridiculousnes. And it takes only one recipe to break the balance. Especially those that don't have alternatives and happen to be badly designed. Doesn't help that stuff like zipirs are a pain to get (or anything related to meat actually) and the only answer from py for that issue is "Wait for PyAL" (viewtopic.php?p=371668#p371668)... This is to date the worst answer from a mod developer i've seen. Some alloys also have weird recipes. Though as much as I hate how this mod is being developed I love PyHT (terrible desease) so much that I can't play without it now and I can take changing some retarded recipes as I go. And with AB and momo tweaks it seems at least a little bit better compared to the rest.
But PyRO is just retarded however you look at it. I went through the recipes to see how things go around and my conclusion is that the complexity and space required for next tiers completely negates the bigger gains.

u think zipir is slow use speed beacons or build larger simple since the inputs for this chains are sorta cheep its not that large of a problem its a 3step process

But PyRO is just retarded however you look at it. I went through the recipes to see how things go around and my conclusion is that the complexity and space required for next tiers completely negates the bigger gains.

just use a build up to the point you think its the optimum
i ,maybe out of sheer lazyness made the tin and titanium builds to require no external input tho since mining titanium is expensive i am seriously considering building further

bottom line :
cheep ore use short chain
expensive ore use longer or the longest chain

also regarding zipir try to use it as little as possibel so make nylon the other way and use fertilizer just for that Sgas

[galibert]

So, dont play with the mods you dont like. Just because you dont like some of my decisions and think its "retarded", you can just disable it and play the ones you consider "ok".

Im kinda tired of people thinking me, nexela or kingarthur have to obey their orders or hear that our work is "retarded" like if it isnt a thing we do for free and optional for the community.

Please don't take the dumbasses that go into namecalling to heart. It ruins things for normal people who just want to understand why some choices were made, and if they were deliberate in the first place. I can very much see a case where the relative yields of recipes have been worked on a lot, but the absolute values not tuned yet.

OG.

[Lurve]

But PyRO is just retarded however you look at it. I went through the recipes to see how things go around and my conclusion is that the complexity and space required for next tiers completely negates the bigger gains.

That's actually one of my favorite design bits. Upgrading whenever you can is not a no-brainer, you need to balance output, efficiency and complexity. If you're rolling in ore, you can splurge on a big array of low-level processing. If you need to make a patch last, use that space for a bigger, slower but more efficient process. Usually you want to get a couple of tiers up and then step off the upgrade train until you have the infrastructure to support it.

The problem with going through the recipes is that starting with blue science, they're balanced with the understanding that you'll be shoving production modules in every orifice you can find. The recipes appear worse, but every ridiculous intermediate step also introduces a 1.2x-ish multiplier. That design choice I much prefer over Angel, who just disables prod mods in everything but the very last step.

Also, you might think Zipirs are a pain to get just from browsing FNEI, but when you're ready to start using them they won't be anywhere near the most complicated thing in your base.

So, dont play with the mods you dont like. Just because you dont like some of my decisions and think its "retarded", you can just disable it and play the ones you consider "ok".

Im kinda tired of people thinking me, nexela or kingarthur have to obey their orders or hear that our work is "retarded" like if it isnt a thing we do for free and optional for the community.

Don't take it personally. He could be less of a dick about it, but I get the sense he's trying to give actual feedback, such as he sees it.

[neurofish]

I think all the guys asking for "imbalance" or "the slowness" of py-mods, including a topic starter, mistake, because there is no problem with mod, there a some linguistic delusion in their minds. They do not know that word HARDCORE is just a diminutive form of word PYANODON (the weakest form among others). If they knew, they would answer easily their questions. Let me explain: why some recipe <recipe name> is too hard and probably imbalanced or has so strange rate or why mod haven't so usable thing <thing name> etc, etc, etc? Easy! Because it is more PYANODON!
And I love it.

[TwentyEighty]

Also...people complain about low ore/plate yield probably because never reached the medium levels of refining...a full chain can give you way more than 3plates per ore.

Is this really true? I must be doing something wrong. Which metals can you get 3 plates per ore? Is this only after sintering and everything? Very few people have ever gotten yellow science to get that far.

I'd have to go back and check but none of the tier3 tech gets you 1:1 AFAIK (maybe iron? Again have to check) so that's probably what people are complaining about

i think nexelite and/or chrome maybe iron too as you suspect i did thee math once but i can't find the paper but i remember some chains had very large gains

I finally closed on this in this thread viewtopic.php?f=219&t=68704&p=418684#p418684

Here's a chart of the best recipe per science tier. It ignores the inputs to each tier, which you should absolutely NOT ignore since some of them get crazy expensive (lead, nexelit, etc). Most people will of course be stuck in the green and blue column for most of the game. Chrome and iron are definitely the best