[Klonan] [2.0.69] Non-explosive cannon shell +25% range modifier is not working

[nbcss]

Summary
Non-explosive cannon shell +25% range modifier was introduced since 2.0.7 for balance purpose, but it actually not working at all. The issue was reported in viewtopic.php?t=128061, but the range modifier did not apply for projectiles from vanilla tank as well (not just modded turret). It turns out the underlaying issue is that cannon shell projectile did not receive +25% range bonus.

What did you do?
Spawn two tanks, one loaded cannon shell and one loaded explosive cannon shell.

What happened?
Shoot at target which around 40 tiles away, their explosion mark are at same distance.

What did you expect to happen instead? It might be obvious to you, but do it anyway!
Cannon shell should explode further away, +25% should be significant!

Does it happen always, once, or sometimes?
Always; tested in 2.0.69 but this issue should exist since 2.0.7

10-24-2025, 11-28-42.png (1.42 MiB) Viewed 493 times

[MrGergoth]

Why? Its explosive range, not tank shoot distance

[nbcss]

Why? Its explosive range, not tank shoot distance

How do you define "tank shoot distance"? I am aiming at a target 35 tiles away and the non-explosive shell just explode at 30 tiles distance like explosive shell. If the +25% range description is accurate, the shell should explode at 37.5 distance from the tank (and hit the target). BTW tank cannon is directional weapon, which mean if I am aiming at 5 tiles away the shell will still travel 30 tile full range then explode.

[MrGergoth]

Why? Its explosive range, not tank shoot distance

How do you define "tank shoot distance"? I am aiming at a target 35 tiles away and the non-explosive shell just explode at 30 tiles distance like explosive shell. If the +25% range description is accurate, the shell should explode at 37.5 distance from the tank (and hit the target). BTW tank cannon is directional weapon, which mean if I am aiming at 5 tiles away the shell will still travel 30 tile full range then explode.

Like any weapon or spidertron that have fixed range. I mean, its should be wierd if ammo1 have more shooting range than ammo2, isnt?

[eugenekay]

The modifier is working just fine with Modded Cannon Turrets with the normal (non-explosive) Shell type.

Range 35 + 25% = ~44.

11-10-2025, 11-44-05.png (128.66 KiB) Viewed 149 times

Range 35

11-10-2025, 11-45-14.png (110.52 KiB) Viewed 149 times

According to the AmmoType definition:

Affects the range value of the shooting gun prototype's BaseAttackParameters to give a modified maximum range. The min_range value of the gun is unaffected.

This has no effect on artillery turrets and wagons even though the bonus appears in the GUI. Forum thread.

This modifier is intended to extend the Weapon's range; not the Explosion's. It does seem like the limitation on artillery turrets/wagons is unintentionally being applied to vehicle-based "Tank Cannons", even those attached to Modded Spidertrons.

[nbcss]

The modifier is working just fine with Modded Cannon Turrets with the normal (non-explosive) Shell type.

Range 35 + 25% = ~44.
11-10-2025, 11-44-05.png

Range 35
11-10-2025, 11-45-14.png

According to the AmmoType definition:

Affects the range value of the shooting gun prototype's BaseAttackParameters to give a modified maximum range. The min_range value of the gun is unaffected.

This has no effect on artillery turrets and wagons even though the bonus appears in the GUI. Forum thread.

This modifier is intended to extend the Weapon's range; not the Explosion's. It does seem like the limitation on artillery turrets/wagons is unintentionally being applied to vehicle-based "Tank Cannons", even those attached to Modded Spidertrons.

I don’t think the modded turret “works just fine”. As reported from viewtopic.php?t=128061, the range of turret is extended but the projectile isn’t. As the result, the turret will keep shooting if a target is between 35-44 tiles but the projectile from turret can only travel 35 tiles (and explode before hits the target). From this perspective, the behavior is consistent between tank and modded cannon turret, since tank cannon only aim at direction and don’t have “max range” (e.g. you can aim at a target from 100 tiles away in tank and shoot, just the projectile will only travel 30 tiles).

[nbcss]

Why? Its explosive range, not tank shoot distance

How do you define "tank shoot distance"? I am aiming at a target 35 tiles away and the non-explosive shell just explode at 30 tiles distance like explosive shell. If the +25% range description is accurate, the shell should explode at 37.5 distance from the tank (and hit the target). BTW tank cannon is directional weapon, which mean if I am aiming at 5 tiles away the shell will still travel 30 tile full range then explode.

Like any weapon or spidertron that have fixed range. I mean, its should be wierd if ammo1 have more shooting range than ammo2, isnt?

Allow an ammo type to modifier weapon’s range is the intended function of range modifier property. There are some modded weapons already using this feature, but I think non-explosive tank cannon is the only ammo in vanilla game has this property. According to 2.0.7 factorio changelog, the +25% range modifier was introduced to non-explosive cannon shell for balance purpose. Consider tank cannon is a directional weapon which don’t have max shooting range (player is allowed to shoot from more than 100 tiles away from tank and projectile will only travel up to max 30 tiles), how do you define intended function of the +25% range modifier?

[MrGergoth]

how do you define intended function of the +25% range modifier?

2.0.7 text is
- Increased damage and range of non-explosive cannon shells.
I was sure its explosive range on hit cuz impact point still have aoe radius, but based on @eugenekay post, looks i'm wrong anyway (that honestly still wierd for me when ammo1 have more range than ammo2 on shooting distance while weapons and turrets have fixed maximum radius but tank in that case isnt)